Annoying Pugs, or "Tales of a Little Tank"

I won't toy with your patience and list the entire conversation from the run.  Suffice to say, I had some people who seemed to be pretty young who got into my group and started chattering.  Nothing useful or interesting, just chatter.  One of them had ganked another of them on an alt, the mage Zord kept linking dps meters after every other pull, just really really pointless crap and confusion and malarkey.

I went into my Real ID whisper window, told a friend that "My group is full of morons.  Except the healer."   I could still more or less see party chat -- I have it set up to pop up a chat dialogue box like for Say chat.

Eventually, though, their pointless chatter that I was happy to ignore turned on me:

Pug Trolling, or "Cyber Bullies Run in Packs"

Note that the instance in question is H-ToC, which I've done on three characters.  Dustfire is my raiding character and has several ICC 25 pieces.  Whether someone likes her gear or not, there's nothing that would make her worth trolling out of a 5-man.

To set this up, I've stopped raiding and have been leveling enchanting.  Since I don't have any reason to properly enchant my gear for now, I've been using unenchanted pieces of my own gear to level it (obviously, I'll replace the enchants later).  Also, note that [Abyssal Rune] from regular ToC is a reasonable alternative when a shadow priest is over hit-capped, which I am (by a lot).  I'm sure there could be some debate on that subject, but it doesn't really matter for this situation.

Drama Mamas, or "My Favorite Column"

I love the Drama Mamas. They handle interpersonal issues, and I like the process of thinking through a tough situation and finding a suitable course of action.

Two days ago, they had an article featuring a player who encountered in-game racists, and some of the language quoted made me feel sick. I've moved a lot in my life, lived in both the north and the south, but I'm undeniably a Southern girl. My parents are born and raised Southerners, and I spent my teenage years in the south.

This means I take great offense to the "southern style" comment. I'm a red-headed descendant of Scottish immigrants; both of my parents came from families who worked hard and honestly. My dad is from a Tennessee farming family with 5 children -- they were so poor, he'd never had ice cream until he was a teenager. My mom's mother was from a Georgia family of 11 kids and worked her hands to the bone from age 14 to age 75.

Yet with all this Southern heritage, I've only heard one racist comment that wasn't in a movie or online, and that wasn't even from someone I knew very well. And he made everyone else (all of us Southerners) feel very awkward.

Irritating, or "What The...."

I do the Argent dailies every day. I have 3 mounts left there. I can't solo Chillmaw, so instead I do the heroic which gets me 3 extra seals. I have no problem with this.

I get a whisper while gathering quests. "Are you doing Chillmaw?"

Eager to get 2 more seals than usual, I say, "I can be. Invite."

No reply.

I wait a minute, then say, "Invite?"

Wait more . . .

"Hello?"

Deadly Boss Mods informs me he's busy fighting in Azjol-Nerub.

He whispered me about Chillmaw either while in an instance, OR he took an instance queue right after inviting me to do a quest. And then he refused to acknowledge my whispers.

What the hell?!

I eventually decided to put him on Ignore, as I was too annoyed to not chastise him if he finally deigned to whisper me back.

I can go back to being perfectly content with my Chillmawless grind. I don't need 2 seals that badly.

Rant, or "When You Can't Escape"

This is a rant. This is venting. This will be neither logical nor happy.

---------

I get husband to do heroics with me, he's a healer, he's awesome, his gear is a little on the low side, but s'okay. We get stuff done.

I start asking for achievements for the Red Proto Drake meta, just collecting 5-man heroic achievements when and where we can, and for the most part people are willing to try and if we can't do it we say so and do stuff the normal way.

We get a couple solid achievements done, all of the ones in Drak'tharon Keep, and then joy of joys! We get into OCULUS! A random Oculus!! It has a MOUNT CHANCE! Add to my collection, GO!

I'm super-excited even though the tank and dps drop group immediately, and we wait for another tank and dps and it's cool, everything's good, because we're in OCULUS! Wheeeee!

Lunar Woe, or "Finishing On A Sour Note"

So I go into Utgarde Pinnacle for my very last elder. Until this point, I have never ever abandoned a group after getting an elder. That's just rude. (I did have a group abandon me after getting it, but I was glad I didn't have to finish Halls of Stone.)

On Skadi, the guy you have to shoot with harpoons, the death knight dps starts ordering the harpoons around and I'm like "Okay okay, fine" but someone didn't pick up a third one that I wanted to grab, so when I got to the harpoon launchers, I was too late to actually hit anything. So the DK rags on me for "wasting" them, tells me to do it right next time, except on the next pass I had no harpoons so he yells at me AGAIN for failing to use the harpoons I didn't have. (Please note that I have been a harpooneer many times without missing, but I become useless when flustered.) So I wait for a harpoon to drop, decide to ignore the DK and do my job and I do it right because I don't have anyone backseat harpooning, and the boss lands.

Except by the time the boss is dead, I'm mad.

Lost, or "No, Not the TV Show"

There is no non-player-induced situation in the world (of Warcraft) as likely to make me cry as being lost in ghost form. Particularly during a pug.

I once ran back to a death knight and led him all the way through Utgarde Keep to the last boss just because I know how awful it is to be lost and not have anyone care or help.

One drawback I've found to the LFG system is that people who haven't done the instances before don't know where the entrance is when you have to run back after a wipe. On my mage, I always wait at the spirit healer until everyone seems to know where they're going, and once I know I don't have to lead anyone back I'll go in myself.

Observation, or "I Dwell on Things"

People tend to use kid gloves on the immature members who will gquit in anger if you say the wrong thing.

People recognize the mature members who won't gquit when offended.

Sometimes, this means the mature get less consideration than the immature, simply because the guild wants to avoid a fuss. In one case, it meant the mature Myself got disrespected so that the Immature People would calm down, simply because I could be trusted not to kick up dirt about it.

This kind of thing sucks. I was so furious back then, I wanted to gquit, but that's why I'm considered one of the stable, mature, sensible ones. I didn't. Because gquitting in a huff is stupid.

Sometimes you don't win if you're the mature one.

Healers, or "The Butt-Monkeys of Pugging"

The party wipes on the first boss.
[Arishicage-Andorhal]: healer u @#$%in suck
[Glendà-Dalaran]: kick me then
[Birdfall]: I think there was aoe or something. Lots of melee.
[Arishicage]: im tryin
[Arishicage]: true but melee wasnt in poison and she needs to heal the tank
The mage leaves the party.
[Arishicage]: im not trying to be a dick but u need to learn to heal and get some gear
[Donagh-Turalyon]: get dps
[Arishicage]: lol
[Donagh]: tru that
[Arishicage]: 1 sec
[Arishicage]: glenda the good witch. leave!
[Birdfall]: Look, I've had at least two of my healer friends cry because of people putting blame on them when it wasn't their fault. So cut it out.
[Glendà:] KICK
[Birdfall]: I don't know what went wrong, but if something did we should figure out what before blaming the heals.
[Arishicage]: naa
[Arishicage]: it was the healz
[Arishicage]: if healer doesnt heal tank
[Arishicage]: pretty sure he is fail
[Arishicage]: thats like number 1
[Arishicage]: plus i have a priest
[Arishicage]: i know wut his mana and hp should be at
[Arishicage]: and he is severely undergeared
[Birdfall]: If the entire party is dying, the healer can't do much at all.
[Arishicage]: ...
[Arishicage]: u obviously dont know wut ur talking about
[Arishicage]: priests have aoe healz
[Birdfall]: Holy do.
[Arishicage]: that heal entire parties AT THE SAME TIME
[Arishicage]: so how would he have trouble keeping up one group
[Birdfall]: I have a priest with holy offspec and my sister-in-law does holy raid healing.
[Arishicage]: idc
[Donagh]: lol
[Arishicage]: this isnt worth 2 badges. sry donagh
[Arishicage]: later
Everyone leaves.

Emberstorm vs Stormstrike, or "Battle of the Battlegroups"

In Battlegroup Emberstorm, when using LFG on alliance side, I've had no real personality issues with pugs. I've run about 10-15 on Birdy.

Today I switched to Dustfire on Battlegroup Stormstrike, horde side.

The very first pug I joined with Dusty? The tank had to fetch a drink for his pregnant girlfriend, called her prego (if she doesn't mind then I don't), which then unleashed the moron in one of the dps who started waxing witty on how the tank could have avoided getting pregnant.

SERIOUSLY.

This is my first LFG on horde and I get that?

I should have left. Dusty doesn't need the gear and I didn't need to sit and listen to "L2Condom." I should have made a snarky comment and made them wait for the system to fetch them another dps.

But I didn't. Because I suck. I whined to my guild instead, and one of my guildies had the insightful comment "Women don't like condoms." Not sure if he was making fun of the guy or serious. I didn't ask and didn't want to know.

Unresolved, or "Bottling Things Up Eventually Goes Boom"

I wrote about the dangers of not talking things out, and I'm feeling the effects of a similar situation. Yeah, I'm PMSing, but every now and then I'm reminded of how pissed and hurt I was when I got backstabbed by my fellow officers (back when I was one), and even though it's been a year I still want to yell and scream and hurt someone. Not because of what happened, or even so much how it was handled --

I'm pissed that I never got a Sorry. That I just got "What's done is done" and "We did what we had to" and nobody ever stopped to think "I dunno, maybe she's upset for something real and isn't just being a hormonal bitch."

It kept coming back in flashes. And I kept repressing. And now it's out and I don't see how I can put it back or approach anyone from that travesty without insulting them.

Server Crash, or "What Sucks Here?"

So my family and I were about to win a Wintergrasp (thank you, thank you, hold your applause) when people noticed they couldn't resurrect.

I figured my healing skillz were needed more than ever, since death had become a permanent state and we only had one more minute to defend the fortress, so I put my back into the effort until we won and the timer reset.

But nobody got marks.

And nobody got quest credit.

Not even the living.

So I sat and watched the angry raid chat until the server crashed and logged us all out.

"They don't care that servers are going down, they just want our money."

I really wanted to argue but kept my mouth shut. The rational truth is that if people can't play, Blizzard will lose customers, thus the guy's perspective has a whopping inconsistency issue.

It's true Blizz is a business, but I've never, in the few years I've been playing this game, gotten the impression the company doesn't care about its quality of service. Players might argue about whether or not what they produce is worth the time and effort, but it is false to say they don't put time and effort into their product.

I also swear to you, as the wife of an IT guy, when something goes down unexpectedly the company scrambles to fix it. They are not just sitting there going "Oh, we'll take care of those servers after we have a snack break." When one of my husband's sites goes down, it doesn't matter if he's watching The Office with me and I'm on an emo hormone binge -- he has to work. So I'm sure the guys sweating away at Blizz, fixing server crashes for ungrateful little snots when they could be watching The Office, really appreciate all the whiny jerks spouting off.

"I swear to God, I'm quitting for Aion."

Yeah, um. Having a bug in the game you're playing is not a good reason to switch to a new game. Brand new games actually have (gasp!) more bugs than well-established games.

Nor does this work as a scare tactic. Nobody actually cares that one disgruntled player is waving around Aion like a flag of war. You want to play it, play it, but stop going on about how you should because Blizz is so fail. If you had the rocks to quit, you would have done it already.

Conclusion

I realize people need to vent when they get frustrated, but I also think some of those guys need anger management. It might be important to get what you earn, but missing out on three Wintergrasp marks is not world-ending. This goes for pretty much any aspect of the game, because some things stick with you longer than success or rewards or even the game itself. Like friends. People who help you -- not because they can get something off of you, but because you have mutual affection and respect for each other.

Report of the Day, or "I WILL Rename You"

So I'm leveling my mining, since a while back I decided Inscription is for suckers (a.k.a. My Husband's Best Friend, who basically is our server's glyphs market). And I love mining. It's like going back to a particularly fun starting zone and doing quests you loved when you first got the game, whereas Inscription was like grinding out an area you didn't know and didn't like.

So while I'm patrolling Hinterlands like a lunatic on my quest for mithril, I've been buffing all the lowbies I run across. I don't pay much attention to them, just pop my health and spirit on them and run off again. Half of them are afk when I do it. S'cool.

After my first run, I smelt a bunch of mithril in the horde town and follow a 46 rogue up to the top of the hill to begin my circuit again. I'm trying to chase him down to buff him because I'm like that. I don't like to let lowbies get away.

So I look at his name, and it's something silly but not clever, whatever, and then I look at the guild name.

Yeah, he didn't get buffed. I passed him at the top with a mental sniff and he stopped, probably to look at me because that's what lowbies do when a max level runs by. I found a quiet spot to stop, tabbed out, armoried his guild, and reported it.

Guild name? "Sapped Girls Dont Say No"

That's actually terrifying to me as a woman. Who in their right mind would use that as a guild name? Sure, it's "clever" in that it combines a real world situation with sapping (cuz nobody's thought of that before), except that it's not funny. It's horrifying. And, frankly, I'm doing those poor morons a favor by getting their guild name changed, since no respectable human being (who noticed) would play with someone with that tag. Disreputable ones, sure. Ninjas, totally. But, I would hope, no one I associate with would touch them with a ten foot pole.

Just . . . ugh. *shudder* That's all.

Trolls and Blizzcon, or "I Cry Too Easy"

I hate trolls.

No, not you, Vol'jin. The other kind.

The kind that keeps being mean until they make you cry. Then they drink your tears because it makes them stronger.

See, I posted my thoughts on a WoW Insider thread about how Blizz should revamp PVP for their NextGen MMO and how my suggested changes would solve my particular problem. Specifically, that I hate PVP servers but must play on one to be with my friends and how I would like to not have to choose between friends and gameplay in their next game.

It degenerated pretty fast into "STOP DESTROYING OUR PVP!!!!"

Pang of Sad, or "Your Priorities are Not My Priorities"

To some people, the novelty aspects of the game are more important than the gameplay aspects. This is because we have different priorities.

A commenter on a recent Pink Pigtail Inn post said:

The dance studio, and flying vehicles in Winterspring are the two things people bring up when they want to point out Blizzard never delivers on their promises. For me, they aren't game breaking features, and it doesn't really bother me that they got pushed back, or eliminated. Personally, I think people that feel 'let down' by blizzard are getting too emotionally invested in minor matters. If they deleted your favorite class one day, I would understand, but if they revamp your talent tree for the sake of game balance or don't release your pet feature in time, it ought not be a source of stress or forum spamming.

It rubbed me the wrong way not because he's wrong -- people do panic over nitpicky things, and a dance studio isn't as game-changing as an entire class -- but I just don't like this attitude. This "It doesn't bother me, so it shouldn't bother you" way people have of approaching the things they don't consider important.

My husband tries to maximize the potential of his characters through hard work. The gameplay itself, the challenge and potential for success, are his lures and his interest. His priorities lead him to arenas, raids, and tons of research into the technical (numerical) aspects of improvement.

I try to make my characters look as cute as possible. I care about customizing them, making them individuals in the WoW community. This leads to tons of research into what mounts/pets/clothes look best and how to get them, which in turn leads to raids, heroics, battlegrounds, and dailies as needed.

I asked my husband how upset he'd be if they nerfed something he liked about his class: "Fairly upset." I then asked how upset he was about them not implementing dance studios: "Um... Meh."

It's the exact opposite for me.

We're not the kind of people who whine and complain and throw fits about stuff we don't like, but just as I wouldn't tell my husband he doesn't have a right to be upset about a class change, he would never consider my pangs of sadness over the lack of dance studios less important than how he feels about his interests.

Politically Incorrect, or "Cranky at WoW Insider"

Is it just me, or does anyone else consider tea-bagging a rape reference? Maybe a lot of these guys don't actually know anyone who's been raped, so maybe they think tossing it around where no one "actually" gets hurt is amusing.

It's not.

So I got pissed at the intro example on the recent guildwatch and related my pissed-offed-ness through the contact form.

I don't care that Mike Schramm and his friends tea-bag each others' dead bodies. I don't want to know about it, but I don't care what they do on their own time, in private. But making fun of a guy who kicks someone from a raid for it?!

/disgusted

I want to reiterate what I've said before: rape is one of my hot buttons. I am not usually super-feminist about stuff (I didn't care about the bunny stuff during Noblegarden), but some things get under my skin and rape is one of them.

When WoW Ends, or "Way To Make My Progress Seem Meaningless"

WoW Insider's Robin Torres had a breakfast topic asking how you want the game to end, with a bang or a whimper?

Her post had the unintended effect of making me whimper.

"WoW is going to be around for a long time . . . but someday it will end . . ."

I just spent days farming a turtle. I'm considering purchasing a $200 eBay mount for my own private amusement (and my birthday). I've sunk massive amounts of real monthly money into this game. So when my non-gamer friends imply that it's all a waste, if I think about the game shutting down some day, I agree.

I mean, yeah I stay in touch with folks through the game. But there are cheaper ways to do that, like buying a helicopter. And I could say I do it because I like it and it fulfills me, but how fulfilled will I be when my $200 mount and $40 pet and the years of life ground into my characters disappears, or when my family ceases to play and leaves me alone with my toys?

I don't mean to be an alarmist or a pessimist. I'm just saying -- I was having fun. Robin's article killed my WoW buzz. And though it might just be the hormones coursing erratically through my system, knowing that doesn't change my heavier heart. (It's not that I mind the game will end, but I don't want to think about it.)

Meh. My mom's making me a bacon and tomato sandwich. I'm going to nom it and steal the remote so she'll stop watching the cooking network.

I wonder if Hannah Montana is on?

Gambling, or "I Kind of Wish It WAS Illegal"

Today I entered Orgrimmar for filling up my Org and Darkspear rep bars (almost exalted!) and saw a guy offering a gambling platform -- win a little if you roll over 70, win double if you roll 100, win nothing if you roll under 70.

I ignored him, mentioned in gchat that I find it annoying, and my guild leader said it was bannable.

I thought "Well, the guy should know that" so I unignored and whispered him.

He said he'd talked to a GM the night before, and the GM had said as long as he doesn't scam anyone, he can gamble with them. I called him on it and asked if I'd get the same response if I talked to a different GM. He said yes. I believed him, because if he'd been lying he would have gotten flustered and defensive.

I said my guild leader was sure it was bannable and I'd look into it for my own curiosity, though I found gambling advertising annoying, and had just wanted to warn him if it was bannable. He said okay and we left it at that.

I didn't remember anything about gambling in the rules and penalties I'd gone through for my penalties post, so I went on the official forums and found the following Blue Post by Vrakthris from a week ago (March 26, 2009):

As stated in a previous thread by Malkorix.

---

Q u o t e:
Casinos are, in and of themselves, not currently against our policies.

That said, we are monitoring the practice and the overall response to it very, very actively.

As I stated in my prior post:
While this practice may not, in an of itself, necessarily represent a violation at the moment, there are activities associated with running an in-game casino which certainly can represent violations; such as spamming or scamming.

Also, if it appears that this practice is being abused or is simply having a deleterious effect on the game play environment, we are certainly willing to revise our stance on the subject. Please remember that our ultimate goal is to provide the best and most fun environment for all our players.

It remains unwise to run an in-game casino, as it is inherently risky. Merely because you can do something does not mean that you should.

---

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=15864858843&pageNo=2&sid=1#30

There are actually a couple of threads about this issue on the first two pages. Here is my response in one of them.

---

Q u o t e:
As Thunderwulf pointed out, Sli, we have addressed these types of threads already. We are Game Masters though, not Developers or Policy Makers, we are only able to uphold the policies that are currently in place.

If you would like to see our policies change you are welcome to post on our Suggestion Forums with your views.

Although our currently policies do not technically prohibit casinos our policies have not changed regarding Spamming or Scamming, thus many the associated behaviors that come with a casino may be found to be against our Terms of Use. Please report any possible violations you find accordingly and we'll investigate and take appropriate actions.

---

Game Master, Customer Service Forums - In-Game Support

This is very recent. Back in 2005, Blizzard banned in-game gambling establishments, which accounts for most people's confusion over the validity of the new wave of gamblers. (Thanks to brother-in-law-in-law for the link.)

So, no, casinos and gambling are not bannable anymore in the game, but they might go back. I find them annoying because they take me out of the game environment and provide reminders of one of the least scrupulous forms of making money in the real world. As you may recall, "The house always wins." And it is often those who can least afford it who are taken in.

For every winner in a gambling scenario, there are many more losers. I do not like greed and I do not like taking advantage of people, and gambling provides opportunity for both even when it's conducted without either scam or spam. There is no regulation inside the game for how to conduct a gambling ring, either, so players can offer unreasonably bad odds, odds that verge toward scamming, without real penalty as long as they stand by their word and pay out when someone wins.

To me, gambling is always a scam because the people running it will always have the edge. After all, they designed the game.

Purple Proto Drake, or "Where Did All the Love Go?"

I've noticed in my guild chat and in forums and even on WoW Insider posts that everyone is complaining about the holiday achievements.

I felt elation when I heard about the changes for Noblegarden, when I heard it was being added to the requirements for What a Long Strange Trip. I was thrilled because I enjoy Noblegarden and didn't want to be stuck with one day to savor it. But I'm surrounded by people going, "Oh, holy crap, I can't believe there's more to do now."

What is that?! Seriously. I LOVE holidays, I adore them. They make me feel like I'm a level 12 starting fresh in the big new world again, no worries and easy experience. I get nostalgic when these events pop up, and I throw myself into them with dedication and joy, feelings I want to share with others so I post here every year with all the details I can find.

But so many people are too busy trying to get yet another notch in their mount collection to enjoy themselves. People are running around with the same bad attitudes so many use for loot -- "Have to get the shiny thing at the end of the grind, nothing else matters."

And it's upsetting to realize that over half the people around me during these holidays consider it a grind. There's no affection for the holiday itself, no pleasure in the quirks, no patience to sit back and enjoy yourself and maybe not even finish this year.

I'm 60 on Birdfall, the character I chose to get this achievement as her main focus (this achievement is her entire purpose right now). She is completely unable to fulfill all the requirements of the holidays until she's high enough to kill the bosses or farm the mounts. I might very well have to wait until 2011 to get my reward.

And I'm not complaining.

So why is everyone else?

Low Dps, or "I'd Rather Have My Friend Than Your Stinky Tauren"

A 25-man Arch run led by Satanface. Arch has seriously good PVP gear as well as Naxx Tier raiding gear.

Plum is my PVP character. A guildmate was asking for one final person for 25-man Arch, I said I'd be willing to take Plum.

Plum's dps is not great. I know this. She's toward the bottom of every list.

My question is -- if you can down the boss, do you still have the right to dump your lowest dps?

Situation

They pull before 1 person is there, so we're down a man.

Tank keeps tanking in the fog. This has been a problem in every Arch I've gone to except IVV-led ones.

Several people dead.

We wipe on the first try.

Raid leader wants his friend in the raid.

So they kick the lowest dps. Me.

Reaction

It's the first time I've been kicked from a pug and is the first time I've pugged in a long time. I don't pug anything but Arch, because of the PVP gear and because my guild gave up scheduled runs after being thwarted too many times by Alliance control.

My problem isn't that they kicked me for low dps. It's that I WASN'T the only reason we failed and shouldn't have been kicked at that point if we still could have done it.

Now, most people will argue "They did the right thing for the group. They shouldn't have had to carry you." I argue that they were carrying the dead more than carrying me. They were carrying the guy who wasn't there more than they carried me. I did my job and while my gear isn't the best, it was the only factor in my low dps. I did nothing else horrible except forget about my battle rez for too long.

So I guess my second question is . . . when is it justifiable to ruin a random pug's day? To actually make them feel so awful, they have to log and do something else?

See, what really gets me beyond all that is that I truly think those guys wouldn't even care if they knew I was a woman and they made me cry by kicking me out of the group. I think they'd laugh or make excuses about how I got kicked because of my gear or tell me to stop complaining and feeling sorry for myself (or, and this is my favorite, "tears are blackmail" so I should stop trying to make them feel guilty), because they just don't want to face the fact that they care more about gear than another person's feelings.

They might have had a reason that most people would consider perfectly justifiable. But it wasn't, not until we'd tried it a second time with a full group, a proper ready check, and then failed.

And, to be honest, they should have whispered me -- this one isn't even about being fair, it's about being a civil human being. "Hey, you were last on dps and I'm sorry but we've been wiping and dps is the problem. Nothing personal, we just think your gear is better suited to the 10-man version." And I'd be okay with that (if we had wiped more than the once). How can you argue if your dps is worse than, say, the people who died halfway through? And if it isn't . . . well, then, you had better dps than them whether or not your gear is crap. You stayed alive. *applause for u*

Anyway. I'm not QQing, I'm just ranting, trembling from reaction, and unable to focus on anything right now.

Yes, they made a girl cry. No, I don't think they'd care. No, I don't like being kicked from groups when I didn't do anything wrong. My gear might have been wrong. Yes, I know this stuff happens to everyone, every day. Yes, I know you can make reasonable arguments for their side. But, in the end, it's just another one of those events that justify why I consider Zuluhed to be filled with flaming jerks and people who don't care about each other.

It's why I'm glad I'm in IVV.

[edit] I'm also looking forward to the dual spec system because they never kick you out if you're healing.

[edit 2] I want to assure you I'm not just complaining because I got my feelings hurt. I afford random pugs the same courtesy that I wanted in this situation. I do not ever agree with kicking people from a group, even that one time we wiped until WG started again. I do not agree with the philosophy that "It's okay to kick people if they aren't putting out the numbers" ever (rude and disruptive . . . maybe). This is very different from most people, I know, and I've always said I shouldn't be a raid leader, but I consider it an ethical issue.